PC-Pro Phantom Boost

[fluke22]

I've been having some problems lately with running WAY too rich off boost, especially during interstate crusing. Idle AFR's are fine. Just about any time I have less than .5 bar of vacuum, the AFR drops to 9. I thought at first I had a faulty AFR gauge, because it (LC1) has spontaneously recalibrated itself in the past, but again, idle was accurate, and also the egt drops quite a bit when the condition occurs. I first noticed the problem when I rewired the LC1 and swapped the injectors for the slightly larger Denso (280cc IIRC) ones. I put the stock ones back in for troubleshooting and it helped a bit (AFR's were at 8.0-8.4 with the larger injectors). I pulled the PC-Pros today and noticed that the main PC-Pro has 4 lights lit when the condition occurs, but the e-cool and timing card do not. I did a quick visual check for kinks in the vacuum line to that card and everything looks ok. I also attempted to pull the line from the card while the condition was occurring. Since with my 6'2" frame I have the seat scooted forward a bit to keep my head off the roll bar, this challenge involved a motion resembling the Charleston and in hindsight was probably not the smartest thing to do at freeway speeds. :eek: There was definitely plenty of vacuum on the line, but I don't know how accurate or necessary that test was.

Is it possible for the boost sensor in one of these cards to go bad?

Thanks in advance,

Geoff

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Geoff,

Could be this problem, http://www.fastforwardsuperchargers.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1137

When you start the engine, you need to go to the "ON" position for a few seconds before starting the engine. If that still doesn't work, we may need to re-flash the cards.

[fluke22]

That very well could be it. I'll pause 10 seconds or so during my next startup and see if that makes a difference.

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Let me know.

[fluke22]

I tried it a few times tonight, all with the same results. I even left the car in "on" before starting for several minutes as a test. The main PC-Pro is still acting like I'm in boost when I'm actually in vacuum. The e-cool card is fine. I also did a more thorough check of the vac line going to the main card to look for kinks, but I didn't find any. Is there anything else you recommend I check before sending them back for a reflash? Also what are the dangers of running this rich? I'm guessing quicker plug fouling and maybe a risk of clogging the cat? The reason I ask is that I have an autocross this weekend I'd like to run in. :yes: I'm not worried about it on track because it's ok while in boost, it's just the drive there that may pose the risk. Thanks for your help!

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

It'll probably be Ok that long. Do you have a laptop?

[fluke22]

Yes, I have a laptop.

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

You have a PM.

[fluke22]

Update: Reflashing to the newest firmware on the main pc-pro fixed the problem with the card seeing boost too early. :) I'm working on retuning now, and the car seems to have perfect afr's at WOT, but under partial throttle conditions, it's still really rich to the point of missing/bucking a little bit right when it goes into boost. Anyone care to chip in with some advice?

Current settings:

Main:

green, yellow, and red are at 1.
green/blue - 4
yellow/blue - 4
red/blue - 5

Ecool card:

green - 1
yellow - 4
red - 4
green/blue - 1

Timing card:

green - 1
yellow - 2
red - 2

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Your E-Cool card is set wrong. I don't think the Green, Yellow and Red actually do anything but they should be set to 1. The green/Blue should be 4 to create proper cooling of the intake manifold air.

On the main card, set the red/blue to 0 and let me know what happens to the fuel.

[fluke22]

I changed the ecool green/blue to 4 and the red/blue on the main card to 1. I haven't been able to tell much difference, but I think I have some other issues. Over the weekend it threw a P0140 and P0171. I reset them, and within 2 miles I got a P0420. So I'm thinking I may have a bad cat, or possibly a bad o2 sensor. The car is at the exhaust shop now, getting a new hi-flow cat and midpipe, so I'll do some more testing tomorrow night. I'm having the mechanic redo the free air calibration on the wideband o2 while it's out, just in case it's out of whack as well. So could a clogged cat cause the behavior I was seeing, or is this just wishful thinking?

Also, since the original problem with the pc-pro has been solved, this may be better off under a new thread. Feel free to close/move the thread if necessary.

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

The 140 and 420 point at the cat but the 171 points a different direction. It is more typical of having replace the injectors with too large of an injector or a bad front O2 sensor. Not a dead O2 sensor that would give it's own CEL but rather an O2 that is going bad and drifting off in signal. Making the ECU think it is richer than it actually is.

Just a thought???

[fluke22]

PROGRESS! Tonight when I got the car back I did some more street tuning. Right now I've got the main card set with green/blue 1, yellow/blue 3, and red/blue 4. It's much better now at partial throttle/low boost (in the 11 range now). At WOT the afr's seem to be pretty steady at 10.2. It still seems to be a little rich for how low I have the yellow/blue, but I might be wrong. I should also note I'm still using the stock injectors for now. Just a thought, but is it possible that I have a map designed for a larger crank pulley? Also, it does go a bit lean (14.0) for about a half second on hard throttle tip in. I think this may have caused the previous P0171, but I'm not sure.

I also got another P0140, and tonight the unusually helpful person at Autozone showed me how the scan tool was showing 0 volts on the rear o2 sensor, so it's dead. My friend at the exhaust shop recommended an o2 simulator for the rear sensor if it was bad, instead of a replacement o2. Any thoughts on this? Even though he said the cat didn't look clogged, I'm noticing slightly lower boost levels now. (maybe .1 or .2 bar less, I'm not sure)


I'll do some more testing tomorrow night. All in all it's been a pretty educational experience, as this is my first time tuning solo. :) I also found the difference between 1 (slow blink on the "1" led) and 0 (fast blink on the "1" led) on the powercards, which I probably overlooked on the forums. :redface:

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

If you want to re-flash the PC-Pro, I have a software method of ignoring the rear O2. Came out of necessity as I have no cat. :)

That lean for an instant would not do a CEL, I don't think.

[fluke22]

Sure, I'd be glad to try the software with the rear o2 sim! So the pc-pro has the potential to control things off-boost, too? If so, is there any way I could get some software that would allow me to view/edit what the PC-Pro is doing? I hope I didn't just bring on an onslaught of other questions, lol.

One question though, is that version the same in all other aspects as the version I'm running now?

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

It can control things off boost or on boost or both. :) It is considerably more powerful than most people think. There is no software for you to view/edit what it is doing but, if I can remember who was the last one to have the spare programmer, I could send it to you and you could re-flash the PC-Pro with a file I would send you and that could do the rear O2 simulator.

It would be identical with the addition of the O2 simulator so your current settings would still be valid.

[fluke22]

hmm... spare programmer... ah yes, here it is. The table it's propping up will have to be a bit wobbly again while I re-flash, but I think I can make do. :biggrin: Just send me a link to the file, and I'll re-flash it tomorrow. :)

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Is your current file in the E-Cool card the 9900_EC.hex file?

[fluke22]

Yes, I'm currently running the 9900_EC.hex on the E-Cool, and 9900_VCB.hex on the main.

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

You have a PM.