First impressions of the Moss NC Coldside.

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

We picked up the 06 in Las Vegas Tuesday and drove it back. Bill had the 90 and I drove the 06. All I can say is 'what a nice ride'. Hats off to Moss for the design and build of this unit. I know a lot of the credit goes to Jason and it is well deserved. They have shoe-horned this unit into a remarkably small space and have done as nice of a fit and finish as I have seen. on an 06.

Our goal is to see if we can 'FFS' it and squeak out some additional power safely. As it is, I would highly recommend this for 06-10 owners. Power is Coldside smooth and torque appears to be available anywhere across the board. More to come on this as time goes by.

ps. It even uses a 5th injector. ;)

[Dr Evol]

Do you have the 100mm or 96mm pulley in place? What psi do these different pulley provide?

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

We need a couple days to instrument it but it appears to be the 100mm pulley. We have EGT probes on order so we don't have to de-instrument Bill's 99. I also need to purchase a new WB O2 as my spare is about to be installed on the 90. We will do full dynos (probably a few hundred based on other test cars we have done) but not until the EGT probes are installed. There is a wealth of info in data logged A/F and EGTs with measured boost on a dyno.

[Satisaii]

Don't have too much fun there. (I say as I drive my desk around the office...)

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

We wont have the EGT Probes until late next week so we have decided to do a base (as delivered) dyno tomorrow. Will post it as progress. :)

[Dr Evol]

Is the amount of boost with the 100mm pulley a secret or didn't Moss ever figure it out?

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

We (Bill :)) have installed a boost gauge and we (Bill) are headed to a 1:00 dyno. The other we (me) is working on trying to get the new dual microprocessor controlled yoyo to market. :)

We (Bill) should have some food for discussion this evening. The EGT probes appear to be a week away. Not as easy to get as I thought.

[RSA_MX5]

Hi Tom,
I think I'm driving the only Moss SC NC (2008 RHD PRHT) outside the USA.
Its still down on power, but I'm in the process of tuning it for my spec model. The tune seems to be way different between US and UK/Euro models.

You are right, it is really a beautiful piece of engineering. Fits and looks like it came factory fitted.

I would much appreciate it if you could data log and share with me the MAF (g/s) and ECU timing advance whilst you have it on the dyno. I'm interested in the RPM point from whereon the MAF becomes clamped.

Thanks in advance

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

It will be a week before we get it fully instrumented and start to gather data. Today is strictly a baseline dyno. When we get it fully instrumented, we will show what we get and what we can improve, if anything. Right now it appears to be pretty awesome. We have an OBD2 data logger and should be able to map MAF pretty easily.

Can you post a picture of the face of your PC-Pro and Timing cards?

[RSA_MX5]

Timing card

[RSA_MX5]

Main and 5th injectors cards look the same.

[Dr Evol]

I guess no one knows or wants to say. I called Moss and they said the 100mm pulley is putting out (around) 5.5 pounds of boost and the 96mm pulley adds (approximately) 1.5 additional pounds of boost.


He also said to be careful running the 96mm pulley since the 06 and up MX-5 engines are running higher compression (10.8 to 1 in 08) than previous Miatas (9.5 to 1 in 1999).

[RSA_MX5]

I guess no one knows or wants to say. I called Moss and they said the 100mm pulley is putting out (around) 5.5 pounds of boost and the 96mm pulley adds (approximately) 1.5 additional pounds of boost.


He also said to be careful running the 96mm pulley since the 06 and up MX-5 engines are running higher compression (10.8 to 1 in 08) than previous Miatas (9.5 to 1 in 1999).

I'm running the 100mm pulley which is putting out 0.4bar (just under 6psi). I won't take that as a scientific fact though, since my gauge has a range of 2.5bar and most auto gauges are never accurately calibrated linearly at the bottom of the range.

[oldtimer02]

Great stuff! I may get assasinated, Thinking about wifey's '08 PRHT automatic!!!LOL!

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

The boost Bill measured was 5PSI through most of the power band. It climbed to 6 PSI to 6000 and was then ~6.5 at redline. Bill can post a dyno chart latter but it made right at 186 like advertised.

[Hawke]

Good to hear some good news coming from the Moss kit. I have a new 09 in my Garage and am looking at my list of things to "upgrade" on it. I'm hoping that the MP62 will fit it :)

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

You will need to confirm with Moss but I believe it fits through 2010. Every day I drive it, I like it more. I hope I get my 1.6L parts soon. :)

[Steve in VC]

Great stuff! I may get assasinated, Thinking about wifey's '08 PRHT automatic!!!LOL!See if she will visit family for a week, and install it without telling her. Then let her take a drive....

[zoom2xtn]

oldtimer02 and steve in vc and I think alike!

I would really like a CS on my wife's '08 and she may never know it was done as she never pushes the gas pedal down very far.

I'll wait on FFS. It's been a year since I've logged on but I'm sure I've browsed a few times to check status of NC progress. Good to see some being made.

GO, Tom and Bill. Hope you both are contented and well.

Lee

[Steve in VC]

oldtimer02 and steve in vc and I think alike!

I would really like a CS on my wife's '08 and she may never know it was done as she never pushes the gas pedal down very far.

I'll wait on FFS. It's been a year since I've logged on but I'm sure I've browsed a few times to check status of NC progress. Good to see some being made.

GO, Tom and Bill. Hope you both are contented and well.

LeeI want them well, but discontented until:

1. They find a way to make 250+WHP safely (well, maybe 300WHP...):yes:
2. Everyone with a Miata has an FFS installed

[Hawke]

You will need to confirm with Moss but I believe it fits through 2010.

Email back from Moss says that they need a couple weeks to make sure it works.

[RSA_MX5]

Tom, do you have any news to share wrt your testing?

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Driveability is good. We have not done much with it as we were waiting on files. We also ran into a manpower issue. :) Bill is doing the WHP increase on the 94-05 kits and prepping the 90 for it's kit. I have been on YoYo duty getting ready to make the trip to China. Bill leaves for three weeks vacation next week. It will be at least January before we get back on it.

[RSA_MX5]

Thx. Please add me to your list for the next batch of PC Pro programmers, :)just in case Bill has sumthing to offer after January

All the best for the festive season & holidays:seeya:

[zoom2xtn]

Yes, I, too, am waiting on info since my wife's car NEEDS a coldside!

Lee

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

If you are waiting for a review, I will reiterate what I said a few weeks back. Runs a little rich (safer?), runs great, has a lot of low end torque that the stock version misses. I think it is easily worth the asking price. It will probably not win high HP races but it is not intended for that. It is a 'street' kit. Great for weekend canyon carving. Bill and I have so much on our plate right now that it will be awhile before we take any shots at it for more power. I think it is capable of over 200WHP easily. Possibly 225-250? It is the high compression that worries us. That AND the unsuccess of Cosworth. Although, I still think the Cosworth problem was letting customers program the main computer. A piggyback like the PC-Pro might have avoided the problem?

[RSA_MX5]

Hi Tom,

Any news / developments with Moss NC as yet?

Kind regards

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

For the time being, Moss can have that all to themselves. High compression engines and boost are somewhat mutually exclusive IMHO. Maybe the 5-6 PSI Moss is making is a good number? Cosworth didn't get it right and now suggests rebuilding the internals, I believe, before doing anything.

[MX-Drew]

Tom and others,

Here is something new (ish) in the UK.

NC Cosworth (http://www.bbrgti.com/product_details.php?id=11649&category=7)

At that price it is just too much for most guys over here.

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Well, the good news is that, for a measley $8000 USD, you get 235BHP (about 200WHP) in a 2.0L engine.

With my kit at $4000 USD, you get about the same in a 1.8L engine. Maybe I am priced way too low? :)

Seriously though, I don't blame them for the high prices. First, they have to recover the high cost of the first fiasco and second, they are hedging their bets on "what's next".

EDIT: Sorry, I forgot, in their kit, you also get BBR Cosworth identification badges. That's where the other $4000 went.