Timing Card

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Well, they are really close. I would like to get a feel for the opening order. I want to get about 10 in the field for test first. After the first ten are out and running, I will ship the rest. I think we are only a week or so away.

List price is $300. $225 for FFS kit owners. That includes the kits originally sold through BRP.

Please send me an email to get your name on the list.

[socal pat]

E-mail sent :drool5:

[liddown]

E-mail sent!!

[BlownMX5]

Me too! It will be nice to get my 4* of base timing back.

[bambam]

e-mail sent last nite!

[maggie]

Count me in!

[thrustn]

I need one too. Sent email.

[sbeck37923]

Hey Tom,

Do I need one of these?

I am the guy in Knoxville, TN running rich without any more room to lean it out on the top end (around 10AFR). I still get ping around 6000+ I think. I am going to the dyno to check things out this afternoon. I want to verify that my wideband is accurate. If I cannot lean it out this afternnon I will probably need to send the cards back for a new program. Will this card eliminate the top end ping?

Steve Beck
99 Miata - FFS coldside - 110mm - Koyo 37mm - Zeitronix Wideband - NOT carb

[jwalton]

Hey Tom! Is there somewhere that I can go to get some details about the card and it's installation? Does it have adjustability like the PCPros? Retard as a function of RPM, boost, both? Does it get easily wired into the harness that you provide? Are you willing to do that for us (for a nominal charge of course :) )?

The price looks great relative to the competition, and I know that it will work, I just want to know what I'm getting and what it's doing.

Thanks.

[chuckerants]

Hey Tom! Is there somewhere that I can go to get some details about the card and it's installation? Does it have adjustability like the PCPros? Retard as a function of RPM, boost, both? Does it get easily wired into the harness that you provide? Are you willing to do that for us (for a nominal charge of course :) )?

The price looks great relative to the competition, and I know that it will work, I just want to know what I'm getting and what it's doing.

Thanks.

Tom said that the timing card is much like the PC Pro. It only has 4 wires to connect and it adjusts just like the PC Pro.

[pumpkin]

This is getting confusing. Is it a stand alone card, or must it work in conjunction with the PCPro?
Seems like everyone is jumping on the bandwagon, but I don't even see what it is, described anywhere.
What are we buying Tom? I may want one.
JD

[chuckerants]

This is getting confusing. Is it a stand alone card, or must it work in conjunction with the PCPro?
Seems like everyone is jumping on the bandwagon, but I don't even see what it is, described anywhere.
What are we buying Tom? I may want one.
JD

It is a stand alone timing retard device. It can be wired directly into the PC Pro harness from what Tom said.

[socal pat]

This is getting confusing. Is it a stand alone card, or must it work in conjunction with the PCPro?
Seems like everyone is jumping on the bandwagon, but I don't even see what it is, described anywhere.
What are we buying Tom? I may want one.
JD

From what I understand It is a separate card similar to the PC-Pro card that will sense boost (just like the PC-pro) and upon a predetermined amount of boost will begin to retard timing at a rate also predetermined. So that your stock timing will be retained until you reach that threshold and upon full boost and past 5000 rpm where the stock ECU might ignore ping, thinking it's engine noise, your timing card will pull a few degrees of timing helping to make you safer from ping if timing was the source.

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Jim,

To install the timing card, you cut the two wires in the harness that go to the coils. There are four wires from the timing card that connect to the now four wires in the harness. Two more wires connect to 12VDC and GND.

There are four adjustments on the card. Green, Yellow and Red; and Green/Blue.

Green lets you retard up to 8 degrees (one per light) from 1200 to 3000 RPM. Yellow lets you retard up to 8 degrees (one per light) from 3000 to 5000 RPM. Red lets you retard up to 8 degrees (one per light) from 5000 to 7500 RPM. Green/Blue lets you set from 0-2 degrees per pound of boost.

On the two test cards that I set up, I set the Green/Blue to 0. On the 05, I just pulled 3* in the Red zone. That let me run the worst 91 (Shell) on hot days with AC on and no sound what-so-ever all the way to red line. The second one was on Jonathons car. His was one of those that you simply couldn't stop ping, period. Even with fuel octane boosters, it would ping from around 3000 and up. Rich, lean didn't make a difference. Lots of E-Cool or little e-cool. On his car we pulled 3* in both the yellow and red zone and it would just purr. He has had zero problems since the install of the card the end of May.

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

It is a stand alone timing card. It is in the same box as a PC-Pro and has the same buttons but the hardware inside the box is different.

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

I guess there may be some confusion regarding the price. :) My fault, I guess. When I talked about the first ten I wanted to get into the field first, I didn't mean the price would change. If you have one of my kits BRP or FFS Coldside), the price is $225 whether you are one of the first ten or not. If you don't have one of mykits, the price is $300. When we start shipping the hotside kits, the price with FFS Hotside kits will be $225.

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

What are we buying Tom? I may want one.
JD


Look at it this way, if I'm selling it, you want it. Doesn't matter what it does or how it works. ;) Just kidding, kind of. :)

[Kyp J]

For clarification for me, since everyone else probably understands, if no boost it doesn't change timing from what ever the ECM is doing, is that correct?

(I can choose via my valet switch to run with no boost if I am feeling cheap and don't want to let my foot use up too much gas. It doesn't care about cheap.)

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Thansk for asking that. I should have clarified. Boost ids required in all cases. No boost, no retard. Off boost is strictly the domain of the stock ECU.

Although, with a Coldside, it is hard not to be in boost. ;-)

[liddown]

You ready for payment? Because I am ready to be retarded!!!!

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

LOL. I don't bill until I ship. Downpayments and pay before ship is for others. ;) As soon as I get them in-house and wire one in my 99 and beat on it for a couple days (130mm pulley?) I'll box, ship and bill. Thanks for all the emails.

[socal pat]

Oh, I hope you have that spare tranny waiting at Mike's place. If I really can run a 120mm I'll need to get those 15x8 949 wheels with 225 Ra1's. Christmas comes but once a year.

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

I have the tranny out of the '02 from Mike's place in my 99. Mike still has my old 99 10AE tranny. It's only problem was 130,000 hard miles (100,000 over 200WHP). The tranny still worked great BUT was getting a bit fussy about down shifting back into 2nd and 1st.

[GO MAN GO]

Exciting news!

Im guessing the retard card Will the card be compatible with
the '01 -'04 with VVT?

And if I'm starting to understand this stuff a little, yet,
Retarding timing will result in a loss of power. So increasing
boost will offset this power loss and beyond?

Maybe I'll be able to put my 115 back on.

[bambam]

wow I was up to 194 whp on my wore out motor..and it was a hoot to drive I could not imagine Tom's 130mm wow.... I would imagine wheel spin with no aid from the clutch..

I betcha you could hear the blower spinning from down the street... music in my hear... and poetry in motion :taz:

I will get there eventually,

Buckwheat

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Jared,

Works great on my 05. I will try the 115 this week and see how it goes. You lose about 1.5WHP per degree. One size up in pulley will easily compensate.

Buck, I can only hope this will allow the 130 on the 99. The low end grunt (175 ft-lbs) just off idle was a hoot. I would gladly give up 5WHP at the top to keep the 175 ft-lbs at 1500. ;)

[GO MAN GO]

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jared,

Works great on my 05. I will try the 115 this week and see how it goes. You lose about 1.5WHP per degree. One size up in pulley will easily compensate.


Only 1.5 hp per degree sounds GOOD. But the '05 doesn't have VVT,
does it?

[jwalton]

You ready for payment? Because I am ready to be retarded!!!!

I can't believe that I didn't see that one coming!!! I've been laughing my butt off 5 minutes now. Classic.

Thanks for the replies Tom et al. Put me on "The List." I'll send an email as well. I also have one of those cars and timing control was going to be in my future anyways due to the track time abuse and just wanting to be conservative.

Woo Hoo! Can't wait.

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Jared,

01-05 are the same engine/controls. Sadly, it also has VVT.

[bogey]

Add me to the list also. I am not in a great hurry, but I will probably buy one soon.

[snakebit]

Lessee:

Timing card - manually pre-set, boost-activated, retards all cylinders uniformly, $225 for FFSC owners.

Ultrsafeguard - parameters manually pre-set, retards whenever it senses knock, retards individual cylinders, $495.

Do I have that right? Did I miss anything?

Seems to me that that the TC is better for gearheads who know when to dial in how much retard, and USG is better for set-it-once-and-forget-it (at the dyno) types and will be much more of a failsafe under variable conditions. USG also ought to cost less hp per degree retarded as it targets the pinging cylinder and leaves the others alone.

Methinks I would fall into the latter category and sleep and rev much better with the USG.

[chuckerants]

Lessee:

Timing card - manually pre-set, boost-activated, retards all cylinders uniformly, $225 for FFSC owners.

Ultrsafeguard - parameters manually pre-set, retards whenever it senses knock, retards individual cylinders, $495.

Do I have that right? Did I miss anything?

Seems to me that that the TC is better for gearheads who know when to dial in how much retard, and USG is better for set-it-once-and-forget-it (at the dyno) types and will be much more of a failsafe under variable conditions. USG also ought to cost less hp per degree retarded as it targets the pinging cylinder and leaves the others alone.

Methinks I would fall into the latter category and sleep and rev much better with the USG.


The question I have is, will the USG be able to detect or "hear" pinging at high RPMs? IIRC, the OEM ECU can't.

[liddown]

I now understand that the current J&S Ultra SafeGuard "has reached the end of production" With the possibility of a new unit being created that might be out end of this year or sometime next year..... So you might have to find a used unit, or maybe someone might have one left in inventory...

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

The timing card pulls timing either based on boost or RPM. It doesn't need to wait to hear knock and then pull timing. Knock sensing is great except it is after the fact. When I had my J&S awhile back with my hotside, it would always show lights above ~5500RPM and pull timing even when I was running 200WHP and 101 octane fuel with a W/A IC. I seriously doubt it was knock but more likely engine noise. It appeared to pull a lot of timing trying to erradicate the 'knock'.

[Serpico]

I now understand that the current J&S Ultra SafeGuard "has reached the end of production" With the possibility of a new unit being created that might be out end of this year or sometime next year..... So you might have to find a used unit, or maybe someone might have one left in inventory...


Good luck finding a used one..... they are hard to come by for a good reason.
I lucked out and got mine from a forum member for $350 and it included the optional knock gauge.

I'm pretty sure John at J&S said it will listen for knock up to 8500 rpms.

Mine works great and I won't be selling it anytime soon!

[snakebit]

I decided to go with Tom's timing card plus a Turbo XS KnockLite. That way I'll know when there's knock and can set the timing card accordingly, preferably on a dyno but also on the road as needed. The KnockLite allegedly adjusts its sensitivity so that it hears knock at all rpms but doesn't give false alarms in the upper range.

I think I'll mount the warning light on my sunglasses or the visor of a baseball cap.:rolleyes:

[snakebit]

Good luck finding a used one..... they are hard to come by for a good reason.
I lucked out and got mine from a forum member for $350 and it included the optional knock gauge.

I'm pretty sure John at J&S said it will listen for knock up to 8500 rpms.

Mine works great and I won't be selling it anytime soon!Serpico, where on the block did you mount the knock sensor? Or does the J&S share the factory sensor?

I've been cautioned to use a separate sensor as the low voltage output of the factory sensor may be too low to "share".

[Serpico]

My J&S is using the factory knock sensor. 6000 miles and no problems so far.

I think the seperate sensor can be mounted by replacing one of the motor mount bolts to the block with it.

[Serpico]

http://www.flyinmiata.com/index.php?deptid=&parentid=&stocknumber=07-36901

[Digitac]

Hi guys. I just got back from a trip and was catching up here and thought I'd add my two cents.

I think my car was the second to get a timing card (after Tom's 05) because no matter what we tried it would not stop pinging! I had already replaced the cat, cleaned the pistons, and Tom adjusted the AFR on the dyno, but it still pinged.

Back at Tom's house he installed the timing card, spent about 10 minutes adjusting the settings and the ping disappeared! I think we ended up pulling a flat 3* of timing anytime it's in boost.

I've put a couple thousand miles on it (at least) since I got back and now all I hear is the engine roaring, supercharging whining, tires squealing, and police sirens wailing, but no pinging! I haven't had to adjust it once and I've run it pretty hard on lots of different gas (91 octane only of course).

At least in my case the timing card cured my impossible pinging problem. Thanks Tom!

Jonathan

[bambam]

Good for you Johnathan! I know watching Tom that day we were all at the dyno kind of felt sorry for him... he was trying to accommodate everyone. I do not see how he does it. You know he aint no spring chicken! :eek:

Good to hear your gorgegous Miata is no longer dubbed the "PING MONSTER"

good luck

Buck

[liddown]

Any update on the timing of the timing?

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Last I heard was this week but my new blowers were supposed to be here last week and not it is next week.

[thrustn]

Tom,

I don't mean to bother you if your still on vacation. But if not, do you know the ETA on the timing card? Sorry I just want to add more power and I'm too impatient.

Thanks

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Word i got this week is that the cards are in and all they need are the graphics cards to put on the front so we know which button is which. Getting closer.

[Chris Papa]

Yeah Baby!!!! :)

[Chris Papa]

I'm an 01-05 owner, and when my car comes under any sort of load....ping ping ping ping ping. When I flashed a strobe light on the crank pulley to see where the timing mark was.......it was waaaaaaaayyyyy advanced.

I find that nearly every month, its good to disconnect the battery (and pump the brakes to get rid of any residual electricity). This resets the factory ecu and brings the timimng mark back to normal and GOD DAMN! :Angel_anim: The ride is much smoother. When the engine starts to feel "rough" I know its time to re-set the ecu.

By the way, does this erase the pc-ro settings?

Just a helpful tip, while you are waiting on your card, its good to reset the ecu around once a month if you have an 01-05 and you get (timing related) ping and your miata is a daily driver.

By timing related ping I mean ping NOT attributable to bad fuel, blocked cat or carbon on pistons

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Hmm. No idea why the timing would get out of whack. The new timing card won't help base timing. Frankly, it wont have any effect on base timing or on timing when off boost.

Nothing will ersase the PC-Pro settings.

[Chris Papa]

Ok,

I'm taking a step back to think about this. I thought the ecu had a "memory"


By memory I mean -when the car is under load (whether on boost OR say in a naturally aspirated car, the air conditioning is on) and the accelertor is flat ot the floor - the ecu advances timimg AND the timing doesn't go back to base until the ecu is satisfied that the timing doesn't need to be advanced anymore. Even well after you are off boost, or don't need the A/C on, and parked your car in the garage, the timing will be advanced even you start the car tomorrow. Is this correct?

Driving my car daily and being on boost on at least one occassion every day with some ping, the ecu chooses to keep that timing advanced and advance it even further until its satisfied it can pull it back. Everytime I strike boost and ping mine keeps on advancing the timing and leaving it there. So when I'm off boost and sitting idle at the next set of traffic lights the timing would still be advanced a few degrees.

I thought thats how timing operated.

I'm not expecting the timing card to adjust base timing, however, when the car is on boost, the timing card will step in and stop the ecu from advancing the timing which will allow base timing to be normal. At the moment when on boost the timing just keeps getting advanced further and further after each session until the car runs rough and I have to re-set the ecu.

[Kyp J]

That sounds like a computer with a ratchet and an anti backup pawl.

[FormerDatsun510Man]

I don't know the exact logic of the factory ECU, but I don't think it has memory to the degree you are thinking. It has base maps for fuel and ignition that were set at the factory. Inputs for these maps are rpm, airflow, throttle position, intake air temp, coolant temp, knock sensor, etc. These base maps do not change over time from what I have gathered. What does adjust the base fuel maps are the STFS and LTFS (short term fuel trim and long term fuel trim). These are adjustments that the factory ECU does on the fly to keep the a/f ratio stoich when in closed loop mode based on the factory O2 sensor. Basically, the STFS immediately adjusts, when in closed loop, to whatever value it needs to be so it is at stoich a/f ratio. If this adjustment is greater than +/- 20% the factory ECU throws a Check Engine code. After a certain amount of time, the LTFS will adjust so as to minimize the STFS adjustment. It is always trying to get STFS to average out at 0%. The same thing goes for the Check Engine code for the LTFS. As far as the timing, I am not aware of any adjustment that the factory ECU does over time like it does for fuel with the fuel trim adjustments. From what I have gathered the timing strictly is adjusted the same way every time based on the inputs to the factory ECU. The knock sensor, one of the inputs, will cause the factory ECU to retard timing (up to 4 degrees I believe) if it sends what the factory ECU interprets as knock.

Resetting the factory ECU clears the codes, STFS and LTFS to 0% and I have also observed it resets the idle air adjustment.

A problem I have seen repeated on '01+ models is the cam angle sensor at the back of the valve cover can get flaky over time. I believe it gets excaberated by hot underhood temps which become more of an issue when you are supercharged or turbocharged. If timing is getting erratice I would look to see if there are problems with either the cam or crank angle sensors. Also, check and see if you have a short or semi-short on one of the sensor wires. For example, if the intake air temp sensor started having a really high resistance, the factory ECU would think it is really, really cold air and advance the timing. Of course, if it is completely shorted out you would get a check engine light for that sensor.

Bill

[BlownMX5]

The bottom line Chris Papa, is that something is wrong. It definitely should not behave as you are describing. If you are pinging, don't drive it. Take this from someone that has already lost a motor to ping. Ping kills.

[Serpico]

Chris Papa,

You have several choices....

Inject Water if you have a coldside $$
A/A intercool if you have a hotside $$$$
pull timing $$$
run race gas all the time $$$$$$$$$$

or

be prepared to rebuild your motor in the near future.

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Chris has a timing card coming if they ever show up. That should make the 120mm pulley he wants, work? ;)

[Serpico]

I'm giving serious thought about skipping the 120mm and going straight for the V8 conversion kit if my motor every craps out..... :)

I think I would like 400 ft/lbs of torque!

[bambam]

my car is pinging over 5.k rpm. But I am running with the AC on and 100 degree weather with a 115mm pulley :nono:

I think I will be rebuilding the motor very soon

Buck

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Buck, Throw a couple ounces of Torco in the tank until we get timing cards. 100F, AC and 115mm pulley is a lot to ask of 93 octane.

Serpico, If I see Bill Williams around, I'll ask if he has any of the Monster Miata kits left. Just so you know, when we hit the straight at Firebird (I was making 202WHP at the time) I would hit the brakes about 1 second after he did at the end of the 5/8 mile straight. He would peak at ~132MPH and I was right at 128MPH.

[Digitac]

my car is pinging over 5.k rpm. But I am running with the AC on and 100 degree weather with a 115mm pulley :nono:

My car used to ping in 70 degree weather with the A/C off on the 105 pully. I'm still running the 105 pully, but even in recent triple-digit weather with the a/c on full I haven't heard any pinging. Get a timing card Buck, and save that engine!

By the way Tom, can I get a new sticker for the face of mine? :)

[Serpico]

Buck, Throw a couple ounces of Torco in the tank until we get timing cards. 100F, AC and 115mm pulley is a lot to ask of 93 octane.

Serpico, If I see Bill Williams around, I'll ask if he has any of the Monster Miata kits left. Just so you know, when we hit the straight at Firebird (I was making 202WHP at the time) I would hit the brakes about 1 second after he did at the end of the 5/8 mile straight. He would peak at ~132MPH and I was right at 128MPH.

Yeah, it's probably not the best idea if I want to keep handling at the top of the list, but I live pretty close to Lebanon Valley speedway and I'd love to try some drag racing with a V8 stuffed under the hood.

There's just something about the sound/feel of a V8 that you just can't get with a little 4 banger.

Guess I need two miatas.......1 blown and 1 converted :)

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Prototype timing card was free. Sticker is $225. Let me know how bad you want one. ;)

My car used to ping in 70 degree weather with the A/C off on the 105 pully. I'm still running the 105 pully, but even in recent triple-digit weather with the a/c on full I haven't heard any pinging. Get a timing card Buck, and save that engine!

By the way Tom, can I get a new sticker for the face of mine? :)

[socal pat]

Prototype timing card was free. Sticker is $225. Let me know how bad you want one. ;)

Ok, I'll take mine with no sticker please ;)

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

LOL. Nice try Pat. If I come across anoother unused prototype, I'll let you know. ;)

[99mx5]

OK Tom please remove the sticker from one and ill take it ;)

[BlackStripes]

My car used to ping in 70 degree weather with the A/C off on the 105 pully. I'm still running the 105 pully, but even in recent triple-digit weather with the a/c on full I haven't heard any pinging. Get a timing card Buck, and save that engine!

By the way Tom, can I get a new sticker for the face of mine? :)

I have an 02 and it pings when the A/C is on and i am under boost, specially under 3500rpms and above 5500rpms. I plugged a OBD2 reader and i noticed something that really caught my attention:

I drive about 11 miles to work (and 12 stop lights ) and in with 90 degrees weather: The A/C on would raise coolant temps in about 10 degrees..... BUT raised air temps up to 38 degrees!!! I think what kills is the amount of hot air getting into the engine. I am planning in getting one of these cards... SOON. Heat soak is a bitch (i have a hotside). Obviously, as soon as you get moving at low rpms, all temps go down... fast.

Tom, would you recommend pulling straight X degrees of timing all the time or based on PSI when you start playing with the timing card?

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

I recommend pulling timing only where needed. Typically 3 degrees from 5000-7000 will do wonders.

If you pull timing based on boost, you will pull timing even at 2000 RPM when you first step on the gas. Normally there is no ping down there and no need to lose performance.

[socal pat]

LOL. Nice try Pat. If I come across anoother unused prototype, I'll let you know. ;)

Let's see... where does Jonathan park his car? :devil:

[bambam]

Let's see... where does Jonathan park his car? :devil:

where do you park yours? I need that motor! :eek:

Sr. El Bucko
no mas diablo 01/04/93

[Digitac]

Let's see... where does Jonathan park his car? :devil:

In a steel cage with an armed guard and a rabid dog.

Well, I used to until the dog bit the guard who then shot the dog. Now it's just in a carport :stuart:

I'll trade you the timing card for the new motor!

[socal pat]

In a steel cage with an armed guard and a rabid dog.

Well, I used to until the dog bit the guard who then shot the dog. Now it's just in a carport :stuart:

I'll trade you the timing card for the new motor!

Yah right! New motor $3200
Timing card.... priceless :)

[jwalton]

Have they shown up yet (stickered or not :) )?

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

:( :( :( :(

[socal pat]

:( :( :( :(

It's probably that extra special glue they use on the colorful label.

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Trust me, I am as anxious as the rest of you. I want to put one on the 99 so I can go back and test the 130mm pulley on 91 octane. :)

[99mx5]

The latest Moss catalog shows the new timing card...


The sticker is grey. ;)

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Maybe I should order from them? :)

[99mx5]

The only problem with that idea is that you wont get FFS service to go with it, try calling Moss at 6AM ;)

[Kyp J]

Would Tom remember you didn't get the card from him at 6AM if you called him anyway?

I don't think I need a timing card anyway because I am nearly deaf.

[Chris Papa]

Bump :rofl: Can't resist a good pun:)

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

I ask them daily where they are. I now live by this prayer:

God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change;
courage to change the things I can;
and wisdom to know the difference.

The timing card falls into the realm of line one. ;)

[Chris Papa]

I know exactly where you are coming from Tom, I've seen projects at work get burnt several times by suppliers delaying delivery, and yeah we had guys sitting on the worshop floor waiting for the supplies to come in and there was nothing we could do....until next time round.

Borrowing from your prayer:

"courage to change things I can" - Yeah the Service agreement - insert Liquidated Damages clause, $1000 a day (cost of having labour stand around & do nothing) for each day the supplies are delayed.
"wisdom" - the supplier wasn't sole source, so we could go elsewhere, so we didn't feel embarrassed or ashamed to re-draft a new agreement and insert that LD clause and the LD figure was negotiated.

We had a really good working relationship and its gotten better ever since! They knew they couldn't get away with murder and we felt comfortable knowing we'll be compensated if things turned out pear shape.

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Happy Days. Just got word they are shipping today. I will ship the first ten on the list and wait to hear if there are hoorays or concerns. Then ship the rest. I should have them Monday.

[Chris Papa]

HaPpY dAyS! Yeah Baby! :driving:

[socal pat]

The new motor is going in this weekend. Now I can just leave that 115mm pulley on there!!!! Just toooo cooool!

[liddown]

Number two on the list says oh yeah bring it on.... Good things come to those that wait....

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Just so you all know before I ship. We found the pressure/boost settings to be more of a detriment than a help so it is strictly three adjustments now. Green 0-8 degrees from 1500-3000RPM, Boost required. Yellow 0-8 degrees from 3000-5000RPM, Boost required. Red 0-8 degrees from 5000-7500RPM, Boost required. They come pre-set to 3* retard 3000-5000 and 3* retard 5000-7000 but you can adjust to what you want from above.

There is no more degree per pound of boost settings.

You will have 6 wires to connect. I will modify the ECU Pinouts in the instruction forum section to show which pins are for the two ignition coils.

[Mark]

Inquiring minds want to know.... who are the lucky 10?

[socal pat]

Just so you all know before I ship. We found the pressure/boost settings to be more of a detriment than a help so it is strictly three adjustments now. Green 0-8 degrees from 1500-3000RPM, Boost required. Yellow 0-8 degrees from 3000-5000RPM, Boost required. Red 0-8 degrees from 5000-7500RPM, Boost required. They come pre-set to 3* retard 3000-5000 and 3* retard 5000-7000 but you can adjust to what you want from above.

There is no more degree per pound of boost settings.

You will have 6 wires to connect. I will modify the ECU Pinouts in the instruction forum section to show which pins are for the two ignition coils.

Yah, in the real world I always found my ping to be RPM related even more than load related. I could be going downhill and ping at 6k at WOT on my 115mm pulley. 3 RPM windows will be easy to do and effective.

[maggie]

Tom,
A few months ago there was discussion about integrating the LC-1, PC Pro's and new timing card. I know the timing card is stand alone but have you gotten any further with the LC-1's? I wanted to know if the PC pro's needed reprogramming as part of the timing card upgrade or if it was a LC-1 only issue.

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

The PC-Pros are a separate issue from the timing card. No re-programming needed. The re-programming that was discussed was only if we got the LC-1 to work closed loop. It doesn't.

[cmetzner]

Tom -

It is reassuring to hear that your card starts at 3*. I have the SS controller from my BRP kit. The programmable map is set to take out a max of 8* of timing. I usually have the timing knob at the halfway point so I use a max of 4* of retard.

Your card sounds much easier to adjust. Do you have to be concerned about "smoothing" with your card? Can you take all of the timing out of the upper end and nothing out of the 1500 - 3000 range?

[SkiZero]

I don't have a FFS kit, but will be going turbo here in a few months. I'm going to assume that the TC will work for that application too on a '99?? Would be great to keep my low end timing and not have to retard 6° all around!

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Chuck,

It does have three independent zones. 1500-3000, 3000-5000 and 5000-7500. Each are totally independant and can be set as desired from 0-8 degrees retard.

I have not noticed any transition problems. I do have a setting that I can change in the base software if needed. I have the "onset" set to 100%. IOW, no delay. When you enter the zone, it switches to that value immediately. I can set that to take some finite time but, unless it becomes an issue when we get these out to test, I'll leave it where it is. The really neat thing is how easy it is to set or change. If you go out on a track day and put in some good fuel, you can easily turn it down/off. Then on the way home when you stop for 91 octane again, simply tap a couple buttons and back you go to the safety zone.


Tom -

It is reassuring to hear that your card starts at 3*. I have the SS controller from my BRP kit. The programmable map is set to take out a max of 8* of timing. I usually have the timing knob at the halfway point so I use a max of 4* of retard.

Your card sounds much easier to adjust. Do you have to be concerned about "smoothing" with your card? Can you take all of the timing out of the upper end and nothing out of the 1500 - 3000 range?

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

It is totally application independent. Should work just fine.

I don't have a FFS kit, but will be going turbo here in a few months. I'm going to assume that the TC will work for that application too on a '99?? Would be great to keep my low end timing and not have to retard 6° all around!

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

OK,

Here is the list I have for timing cards. Only using the first three letters of your last name. If you have changed your mind, let me know. If your name doesn't appear, let me know and I'll add it. Send me an email with "Timing Card" in the Subject line.

My 99
Pat Wal
James Haz
Mark Wol
John Pes
David Wic
Pat O'ne
Chris Pap
Steven Cha
Steve Law
James Low
Phil Ly
Paul Hut
Hector Mal
Chuck

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

OK. There was a glitch as they put in the wrong program and the 0 Boost point was not calibrating correctly. I have that fixed and will box them up this weekend and ship Monday. Sorry for the delay but I wanted to test it first. Glad I did. Extra thanks to Jason @ Moss for aiming me the right direction to fix them.

BTW, I can run top redline in Arizona heat now on 91 octane and a 130mm PULLEY. It took 6 degrees of retard and I guess that to mean ~9WHP at 7000. An easy price to pay to have all that low end torque. I have a feeling that I could probably run 100 octane with only 3* retard. My guess is that I am ONLY making 220 :) at redline but 1500RPM torque is ~170 ft/lbs from the last trip to the dyno with the 130. Not bad for a "non-intercooled" Coldside. Now where did I leave that 150mm pulley sitting?

[SkiZero]

Glad to hear everything is working out on these! GREAT news!!!

[Mx5-4me]

OK. There was a glitch as they put in the wrong program and the 0 Boost point was not calibrating correctly. I have that fixed and will box them up this weekend and ship Monday. Sorry for the delay but I wanted to test it first. Glad I did. Extra thanks to Jason @ Moss for aiming me the right direction to fix them.

BTW, I can run top redline in Arizona heat now on 91 octane and a 130mm PULLEY. It took 6 degrees of retard and I guess that to mean ~9WHP at 7000. An easy price to pay to have all that low end torque. I have a feeling that I could probably run 100 octane with only 3* retard. My guess is that I am ONLY making 220 :) at redline but 1500RPM torque is ~170 ft/lbs from the last trip to the dyno with the 130. Not bad for a "non-intercooled" Coldside. Now where did I leave that 150mm pulley sitting?

how close is that 150mm pulley going to put you to the max RPM of the SC??

[socal pat]

HA!! I just happened to mail my check out today just cuz. Looking forward to a dyno printout on the 130mm. Geez Tom, you don't let much grass grow under you.... already looking for the next pulley. I'll just be happy with a nice safe 115mm.

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

I'm saving the 150 for Pat. 150/65 would make about 16K at 7K engine. Magnuson life tests at 16K so that would be just fine. Not sure I have 150mm courage, yet. Give me a week. ;)

[Mx5-4me]

I'm saving the 150 for Pat. 150/65 would make about 16K at 7K engine. Magnuson life tests at 16K so that would be just fine. Not sure I have 150mm courage, yet. Give me a week. ;)

yeah. took me a bit to find the nose pulley size..

should be around 16150 RPM on the blower when the engine is at 7k ...

[socal pat]

I'm saving the 150 for Pat. 150/65 would make about 16K at 7K engine. Magnuson life tests at 16K so that would be just fine. Not sure I have 150mm courage, yet. Give me a week. ;)

Nah, I think you should give that 150 to Chuck. He's a brave guy, and the head shill ;)
Oh, and just a reminder to please include those 2 screws? Thanks.

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Coward. ;)

OK I'll do it myself. :)

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Well, I have heard from a couple of you that have received the timing card that, now that you have it, you would like to know how to wire it. :)

I have updated the ECU wiring in the "Instructions" forum for the 4 model groups. 95-95, 96-97, 99-00, 01-05. You will see that the added pins are IGN1 and IGN 2. IGN 1 is for cylinders 1/4 and IGN 2 is for cylinders 2/3. Here's the directions:

1. Remove the PC-Pro harness
2. Find the IGN 1 and IGN 2 wires for your model.
3. Cut those two wires near the middle.
4. Connect the Yellow wire to the ECU side of IGN 1.
5. Connect the White/Yellow wire to the car harness side of IGN 1.
6. Connect the Grey wire to the ECU side of IGN 2.
7. Connect the Green/Grey wire to the car harness side of IGN 2.
8. Connect the Red wire to the PC-Pro Red wire.
9. Connect the Black wire to the PC-Pro Black wire.
10. Connect the vacuum tube to the card and to the included Y connector.
11. Cut the vacuum line to the PC-Pros at a convenient place and insert the new Y connector.
12. Have fun. :)

Remember, do NOT use the Green/Blue setting. It will reduce power unnecessarily. The Green, Yellow and Red are adjustable from 0-10 Degrees Retard in the 1500-3000, 3000-5000 and 5000-7500 RPM ranges respectively.

[socal pat]

One question.... What's a harness? :tongue:

[snakebit]

One question.... What's a harness? :tongue:It's a retention device you put on the wife before you tell her that you MUST spend another $300 on your Miata.:toetap05:

[socal pat]

You mean you TELL your wife??? :eek:

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Actually, I think it is a retention device his wife puts on him when he even brings up the subject of spending more money on his car. ;)


It's a retention device you put on the wife before you tell her that you MUST spend another $300 on your Miata.:toetap05:

[ROZ]

How many people out there have adjusted their timing cards from the FFS default settings?

[socal pat]

I may have. To be honest I'm not sure what the default is. Tom and I took a ride and he said "set X color on #3" I did. Then we did another run "now set y color on #2" I did. On a 115 pulley I haven't had 1 ping yet. Hell, I may have pulled a degree of timing too much, but until I'm safely on a dyno I'm not changing a thing.

[Tom @ Fast Forward]

Defaults are:

GREEN = 0
YELLOW = 1.5
RED = 2.5